Omaha/Omaha hi-lo Cash game play

[CardWarfare]

Omaha and Omaha 8 or better strat goes in here

[gkunit20]

So, it looks like I get to be the first to post in here. I consider O8 to be my best game, so fire any questions you may have.

[CardWarfare]

I can see us having some good O8 discussions with anyone on here that plays O8 regularly. I consider O8 probably my second best game, after limit holdem.

[TenMostWanted]

O8 always seems to make me angry because, no matter what your starting hand is....everyone at the table can look at there hand, and see a handful of outs, and nobody lays down.
However, I played an O8 tourney a while back, and it went pretty good, made the final table.

[k1ller22]

I have played holdem exclusively for 2 years. Recently we started playing Omaha at my home game, so i decided to give it a try online. I have had mixed results. I came in 2nd in a tourney on Tony G and won 37.50 and I have also lost about 30 playing at a cash table. I am looking for any advice for playing O8 cash games. What starting hands should I play? Should I play a hand that really only has a chance at the low (A,2,3,4 none suited)?

Thanks,
K1ller22

[CardWarfare]

Originally Posted by k1ller22

I have played holdem exclusively for 2 years. Recently we started playing Omaha at my home game, so i decided to give it a try online. I have had mixed results. I came in 2nd in a tourney on Tony G and won 37.50 and I have also lost about 30 playing at a cash table. I am looking for any advice for playing O8 cash games. What starting hands should I play? Should I play a hand that really only has a chance at the low (A,2,3,4 none suited)?

Thanks,
K1ller22

Basically, in online O8 games, especially at the low limits, it's a showdown contest. You are going to be showing down a hand, usually multiway, basically every pot you play. This means you need very strong hands to start with. Strong starting hands turn into the two-way nuts, or at least the nuts with a re-draw.

I would suggest checking out the link at the bottom of this post. It's an fCP post on general strategy for begininers. Basically, O8 is ridiculously profitable online, especially at low limits, because people simply don't understand the proper way to play it.


As far as VERY general starting hand requirements go, for begininers, keep it simple. Don't leave home without an Ace, and usually a suited one. From early position, I'm looking for a suited Ace, as well as as many other wheel cards (2,3,4,5) as possible. Obviously, a pair of suited Ace/Low combinations are your best possible hands (AA23 double suited is the best possible).

The one thing I can tell you is that in this game, big pairs in the hole mean NOTHING unless you flop a set. You will almost never win the hi end of the pot with simply an overpair, so hands like JJ45 are trash and should be thrown away. Also, don't overvalue AAxx hands. Hands like AA97 are pretty much garbage, as your hand is useless if you don't flop an ace.

Basically, Omaha 8 is a game of the nuts. Plain and simple. If you made you flush, and there's a pair on board with tons of action, you're probably beat. If you've made a boat with 44xx on a board of 4-5-k-k-9, and it's a multiway pot with tons of capping, it's safe to say you're beat.



Overall, the biggest advice I can give you, is don't draw to half the pot. It's the best advice one person can give another when learning a split-pot game. Drawing to the nut low, with absolutely NO chance at winning the high, only feeds the rake, and when you get counterfieted, or quartered... you will regret it, big time. Don't draw to the second nuts, and don't draw to half the pot.

And read akishore's stategy guide. It's in two parts, and I linked it below..


http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poke...showtopic=3312

http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poke...showtopic=3391

[k1ller22]

Wow, this is great. Thanks Cardwarfare. I can see some of the mistakes I was making already. I was definitely overvaluing high pocket pairs, but not anymore. I can't wait to get to the tables with this new info.

Thanks again,
K1ller22

[CardWarfare]

Originally Posted by k1ller22

Wow, this is great. Thanks Cardwarfare. I can see some of the mistakes I was making already. I was definitely overvaluing high pocket pairs, but not anymore. I can't wait to get to the tables with this new info.

Thanks again,
K1ller22

Glad I can help :wink: O8 is a great game, so enjoy all the profitability


One thing I should mention that I didn't stress enough in my original post above, is the importance of A2xx combinations. I suggest not leaving home without an ace, but a deuce is a very imporant counterpart. If you're playing A4's and A5's too often, you're going to get yourself in trouble on flops like 6-4-7. Most times you are drawing against A2, and unless they get counterfieted, (with a duece on the board) you'll be dead, and losing a lot of money in the long run

[CardWarfare]

To further my point to k1ller... Here's an example of the types of things you should be thinking during a typical (good) O8 hand...

Just played this for my $1 challenge...


PokerStars Game #7228765716: Omaha Hi/Lo Limit ($0.02/$0.04) - 2006/11/29 - 18:15:20 (ET)
Table 'Vela' 10-max Seat #3 is the button
Seat 1: 32Lucky ($1.17 in chips)
Seat 2: okidoki333 ($0.20 in chips)
Seat 3: AZ BILL ($0.46 in chips)
Seat 4: CardWarfare ($0.64 in chips)
Seat 5: zzcatch22 ($1.07 in chips)
Seat 7: joy46 ($0.82 in chips)
Seat 8: Ernie-Love ($0.96 in chips)
Seat 9: JellyBean113 ($1.08 in chips)
Seat 10: sara260 ($0.76 in chips)
CardWarfare: posts small blind $0.01
zzcatch22: posts big blind $0.02
#9 Tony Romo: sits out
okidoki333: posts big blind $0.02


*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to CardWarfare [3c 3s Ac 7d]
joy46: calls $0.02
Ernie-Love: calls $0.02
JellyBean113: calls $0.02
sara260: folds
sara260 leaves the table
32Lucky: folds
okidoki333: checks
AZ BILL: calls $0.02
CardWarfare: calls $0.01
zzcatch22: checks


Here I'm thinking that my hand is flop worthy, and definately very playable from the small blind. I'm not going to get silly and raise it, but I do want to see a flop. With a suited A3, I'm going to be looking for clubs, as well as specifically a deuce. If a deuce and another low card hit, that isn't a 3 or an Ace, I will have the nut low draw, and if two clubs hit, I'll have a nut flush draw.

*** FLOP *** [5s 2c Jc]
CardWarfare: bets $0.02
zzcatch22: calls $0.02
joy46: calls $0.02
Ernie-Love: calls $0.02
JellyBean113: folds
okidoki333: folds
AZ BILL: calls $0.02


This is a gin flop. It's got everything I'm looking for. I now have the nut flush draw, as well as the nut low draw. I also have a draw to the wheel. Basically, these are the dream situations in O8. You'll want to get as much money in as possible here, but you also don't want to alienate people. You want as many draws in as possible, since you have the best of each possible draw.


*** TURN *** [5s 2c Jc] [4s]
CardWarfare: bets $0.04
zzcatch22: calls $0.04
joy46: folds
Ernie-Love: calls $0.04
AZ BILL: calls $0.04


This hand keeps getting better and better! I now have the wheel, or 5-high straight, making the low a lock. I'm now guaranteed at least part of this pot, and with a straight, and nut low, I'm in good shape to scoop. But, don't forget we still have the nut club draw as well! so Just in case someone else had A3 in their hand (unlikely, since we have two 3's in the hole, but still very possible) we have a re-draw to beat them and win 3/4 of the pot.


*** RIVER *** [5s 2c Jc 4s] [Kc]
CardWarfare: bets $0.04
TNPhoenix29 joins the table at seat #10
zzcatch22: calls $0.04
Ernie-Love: calls $0.04
AZ BILL: calls $0.04


Boom. Gin. I now know that I am going to win, at LEAST 3/4 of this pot, most likely I'll be scooping the whole thing. Not only that, but I got paid off in 3 spots, which is always nice. I was hoping someone was on a worse club draw and would raise here, but I'm satisfied with the pot as it is.

Now it's time to show and watch them all muck...

*** SHOW DOWN ***
CardWarfare: shows [3c 3s Ac 7d] (HI: a flush, Ace high; LO: 5,4,3,2,A)
zzcatch22: mucks hand
Ernie-Love: mucks hand
AZ BILL: mucks hand
CardWarfare collected $0.27 from pot
CardWarfare collected $0.27 from pot


This is what you should be looking for while playing O8. You should always be drawing to a scoop, never to half. Also, notice that at no point in this hand did I try anything tricky. Simply get as much money in as you can, don't try to check/raise or anything fancy, since it will most likely isolate you against one player at best, and that isn't a situation we want. In hands like these, we want as many people in the pot as possible. We have the best of every draw, and we want people chasing worse draws, chunking more bets in the pot on each street drawing nearly dead.



Hope this helps

[CardWarfare]

What do we think of this preflop action? Cap or not to cap?


PokerStars Game #7230563983: Omaha Hi/Lo Limit ($0.10/$0.20) - 2006/11/29 - 20:21:31 (ET)
Table 'Aristaeus II' 10-max Seat #5 is the button
Seat 1: CardWarfare ($4.67 in chips)
Seat 2: REman666 ($7.96 in chips)
Seat 3: My02 ($5.14 in chips)
Seat 4: MagRose ($2.58 in chips)
Seat 5: jamminjude ($8.94 in chips)
Seat 7: Young252 ($3.24 in chips)
Seat 8: kulikp ($3.02 in chips)
Seat 9: olygene ($3.09 in chips)
Seat 10: ~idonigl~ ($3.70 in chips)
noelkylie will be allowed to play after the button
Young252: posts small blind $0.05
kulikp: posts big blind $0.10


*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to CardWarfare [Qh 2d Ah Qd]
olygene: calls $0.10
~idonigl~: folds
CardWarfare: raises $0.10 to $0.20
REman666: folds
My02: calls $0.20
MagRose: folds
jamminjude: folds
Young252: folds
kulikp: raises $0.10 to $0.30
olygene: calls $0.20
CardWarfare: raises $0.10 to $0.40
Betting is capped
My02: folds
kulikp: calls $0.10
olygene: calls $0.10